KRISTEN WELKER:
This Sunday: Breakthrough. Hamas agrees to release all Israeli hostages and expresses a willingness to accept President Trump’s peace plan.
PRES. DONALD TRUMP:
Everybody was unified in wanting this war to end and seeing peace in the Middle East, and we’re very close to achieving that.
KRISTEN WELKER:
Will the plan work? I’ll talk to Secretary of State Marco Rubio. Plus: Standoff. The federal government shutdown drags on after Republicans reject Democrats’ demands to extend health insurance subsidies.
REP. HAKEEM JEFFRIES: The public knows that Donald Trump and Republicans have shut the federal government down.
SPEAKER MIKE JOHNSON: Democrats in Congress have dragged our country into another reckless shutdown to satisfy their far-left base.
KRISTEN WELKER:
How long will it last? And how many federal workers could face layoffs? I’ll talk to Republican Speaker of the House Mike Johnson of Louisiana and House Democratic Leader Hakeem Jeffries of New York. Plus: “War from within.” At a gathering of the military’s top leader President Trump warns of what he calls a “war from within” that he wants to fight using the U.S. Military against American citizens.
PRES. DONALD TRUMP:
We should use these dangerous cities as training grounds for our military.
KRISTEN WELKER:
I’ll talk to Democratic Senator Adam Schiff of California. Joining me for insight and analysis are: NBC News Chief Foreign Affairs Correspondent Andrea Mitchell, NBC News Chief Capitol Hill Correspondent Ryan Nobles, Marc Short, former director of legislative affairs for President Trump. And Neera Tanden, president of the Center for American Progress. Welcome to Sunday, it’s Meet the Press.
ANNOUNCER:
From NBC News in Washington, the longest-running show in television history, this is Meet the Press with Kristen Welker.
KRISTEN WELKER:
Good Sunday morning. The nation is at the epicenter of history-making moments here at home and on the global stage. In Washington, business has ground to a halt for the fifth straight day – the government closed with lawmakers deadlocked over how to reopen it. And in the Middle East – just days before the two-year anniversary of October 7th attacks, a potential breakthrough on President Trump’s 20-point peace proposal. Hamas agreeing to release all of the hostages and Israel vowing to halt bombing in Gaza. But with key details still lingering – can the nearly two-year war come to an end? And joining me now is Secretary of State Marco Rubio. Secretary Rubio, welcome back to Meet the Press.
SEC. MARCO RUBIO:
Thank you.
KRISTEN WELKER:
Well, I want to start with these peace negotiations in the Middle East. Is this now the end of the war in Gaza?
SEC. MARCO RUBIO:
Well, not yet. There's some work that remains to be done. And I would view it in two phases in terms of understanding how to break this out. The first piece of it, which is very clear from the letter and Hamas's response, is they have agreed to the president's hostage release framework. And what needs to happen now, and they acknowledge in the letter in their response, is there now needs to be meetings which are occurring even as I speak to you now and hopefully will be finalized very quickly on the logistics of that. What that means is, you know, who goes in to get them? Is is Red Cross? You know, when do they show up, et cetera, you know, what place are they going to be? And the conditions have to be created for that to happen. You know, you can't have bombs going off and fighting going on in the middle of this exchange. So that's piece one – and we want to see that happen as soon as possible, all 48 hostages, both living and deceased need to be released. And there's some logistical challenges to that that we'll have to work through. But that work is happening even as I speak to you this very moment. The second part of it, it's even harder. And that is the long-term piece. What happens after Israel pulls back to the yellow line and potentially beyond that as this thing develops? How do you create this Palestinian technocratic leadership that's not Hamas, that's not terrorists, and with the help of the international community? How do you disarm any sort of terrorist groups that are going to be building tunnels and conducting attacks against Israel? How do you get them to demobilize? All that work, that's going to be hard. But that's critical because without that, you're not going to have lasting peace. You may get the hostages back, you may get a cessation of hostilities, but in the long term, it's going to happen all over again. So both are going on at the same time. But priority number one, the one that we think we can achieve something very quickly, on hopefully, is the release of all of the hostages in exchange for Israel moving back to that yellow line, which is basically where they stood at the middle part of last month, of August. And that's the one we're focused on. Even as I speak to you now, there are people meeting on that.
KRISTEN WELKER:
I want to drill down on the timing of the hostages in just a moment, but first, just big picture. President Trump seems to be taking Hamas's response as a “yes” to his peace proposal. As you've indicated though, there's a lot that still needs to be worked out. Hamas didn't mention laying down its arms, for example. Do you see Hamas' response as a “yes” to President Trump's peace proposal?
SEC. MARCO RUBIO:
Well it’s certainly a “yes” to – well, look, it's Hamas, okay? So I'm not telling you here that these are people I trust 100% nor should we. But they have said basically that they agree to his proposal and the framework for releasing the hostages. That's an enormous achievement. They've also agreed, in principle, in generality, to enter into this idea about what's going to happen afterwards, the Palestinian technocrats, et cetera. There's a lot of details that are going to have to be worked out there. But look, this is a plan that the president put forward. But let's remember, it has the strong support of the UAE, of Qatar, of Egypt, of Saudi Arabia, the Turks, Indonesia, all these others. So there's a lot of international pressure on Hamas to make this happen. And we're going to need them and the European Union, you know, and countries from around the world to also participate in making this thing work. So that second phase, the phase you're discussing, the disarmament, demobilization, that's not going to be easy. That's going to be hard. But it is really important because without it, without demobilization, you're not going to have a lasting peace. A lot of work has to happen there. And we acknowledge that and we want it to work out and we're going to do everything we can to make it work.
KRISTEN WELKER:
Prime Minister Netanyahu has indicated he expects the hostages to be released as soon as this week. Is that your expectation that the hostages will be released this coming week, Mr. Secretary?
SEC. MARCO RUBIO:
I mean, I would like the hostages to have been released yesterday. Now we need to work through the logistics of how that's going to happen. I mean, and again, that sounds simplistic, but it's not just about, you have to make sure that there's no fighting going on, you have to make sure the Red Cross can get there, what time they're going to be there, where they're going to be. All that has to be worked through. And that's not easy in the middle of an active war zone. That has to be deescalated. And that's exactly what they're meeting about right now. I mean, that's what the talks are about.
KRISTEN WELKER:
But they could be released this week, Mr. Secretary?
SEC. MARCO RUBIO:
That's what the high-level talks are going to be in Cairo tomorrow –
KRISTEN WELKER:
They could be released this week?
SEC. MARCO RUBIO:
Oh, our expectation, yeah, we want it to be as soon as possible. There's no doubt about it. We want it as soon as possible. It needs to happen as quickly as possible. And we will know very quickly whether Hamas is serious or not by how these technical talks go in terms of the logistics. But absolutely, we want these hostages, all of them, living and deceased, released as soon as possible.
KRISTEN WELKER:
Let me ask you about Israel's role in this. Israel has not agreed to fully withdraw from Gaza. What is the timeframe by which the United States wants to see that happen? Are we talking weeks, months, years?
SEC. MARCO RUBIO:
No, listen, so first of all, they have agreed. And that's part of the release to move back to the yellow line, which is what they've called it. It's basically where Israel stood in the middle of August. And so they've agreed to that piece. And I think ultimately, everyone has agreed, including Israel, that eventually, at some point here, as this process plays out, Gaza will be governed by a Palestinian technocratic group that's not Hamas, that are not terrorists, with the help and the assistance and the guidance of an international consortium like the Board of Peace, et cetera. That is the goal. Everyone who's signed onto this agreement has agreed to.
KRISTEN WELKER:
What's the time frame though, Mr. Secretary? Weeks, months, years?
SEC. MARCO RUBIO:
Yeah, you can't set up a government structure in Gaza that's not Hamas in three days. I mean, it takes some time. And when we ask Israel, "Okay, you're at the yellow line, now everything behind it, you have to turn it over." You have to have somebody to turn it over to. So, I mean, let's be realistic here. You can't just set up a sort of new government structure inside of Gaza in 72 hours. It's going to take some time to do it. The important thing is that there's a plan, it's being executed, it has the money, it has the support, it has the expertise, and that it's moving forward, and everyone has agreed to the parameters of it. But that is ultimately the goal here, that everyone who signed onto President Trump's deal has agreed to.
KRISTEN WELKER:
Mr. Secretary, I want to read point 19 of the president's peace plan. I'll put it up so folks can see it. It says, quote, "While Gaza redevelopment advances, and when the [Palestinian Authority] reform program is faithfully carried out, the conditions may finally be in place for a credible pathway to Palestinian self-determination and statehood, which we recognize as the aspiration of the Palestinian people." Does the Trump Administration now support Palestinian statehood, Mr. Secretary?
SEC. MARCO RUBIO:
Well, look, first of all, that provision was very important to the countries that signed on with us. And Saudi Arabia, UAE, Qatar, et cetera, they all really, that's a very important point to them. I think the most important point to read out of that is that you have to have somebody to turn it over to, right? Someone that you can hand that over to – we've always said that, that if there's going to be a two-state solution, it has to be negotiated with Israel. It has to make sure that Israel's security is taken into account. And so I would argue that, I wouldn't say this is a new policy position. What I would say is, you want to be able to have in Gaza – a place – Israel has no interest in governing Gaza. They want to turn it over to somebody, some organization that will govern it, that will not build tunnels and sponsor terrorism and come across the line and kidnap, rape, and murder Israelis. That's who they want to turn it over to.
KRISTEN WELKER:
But Mr. Secretary --
SEC. MARCO RUBIO:
And right now, that doesn't exist. That has to be built.
KRISTEN WELKER:
But Mr. Secretary, in terms of where the administration stands, yes or no? Does the Trump Administration support Palestinian statehood?
SEC. MARCO RUBIO:
That's not a yes or no question. That's a process. No, but that's not a yes or no question. That's a process. Ultimately, at the end of the day, we've always said, this has been a consistent position of this administration, of myself, and of a lot of people that have watched this for a very long time. In order for that aspiration to even be credible, it has to be realistic. We can't have a Palestinian state that's governed by Hamas or by some terrorist organization whose stated purpose for existence is the destruction of the Jewish state. That would never work. Until Gaza is governed by people that are not interested in destroying Israel, until there are no security threats emanating against Israel from Gaza, forget about statehood, you're not going to have peace. So we have to create the conditions for that. That's going to take a while. And that's going to be part of what these negotiations are about in the days to come. But right now, the priority, number one, is to get the hostages released. If we can't even get an agreement on the hostages being released, you ain't going to have long-term peace here. So let's get that piece done. It's the most important. And then we can move to phase two – and it will give momentum to the rest of the effort – but this is not going to be easy. No one said this was going to be easy. We are dealing with something that's been going on for a very long time.
KRISTEN WELKER:
All right. Secretary of State, Marco Rubio, thank you very much for your time this morning. We really appreciate it.
SEC. MARCO RUBIO:
Thank you, thank you.
KRISTEN WELKER:
And when we come back, the government shutdown drags on into its second week. How does it end? House Speaker Mike Johnson and House Democratic Leader Hakeem Jeffries join me next.
KRISTEN WELKER:
Welcome back, and joining me now is House Democratic Leader Hakeem Jeffries of New York. Leader Jeffries, welcome back to Meet the Press.
REP. HAKEEM JEFFRIES:
Good morning, great to be with you.
KRISTEN WELKER:
Well, it's great to have you here on a very busy morning. I do of course want to get to the shutdown. But first, I have to ask you about these developments in the Middle East. Of course Hamas saying that it will in fact turn over the hostages. Leader Jeffries, let me ask you, do you support President Trump's 20-point peace proposal?
REP. HAKEEM JEFFRIES:
Well, I support a path for a just and lasting peace. And that needs to involve making sure that every single hostage and the remains of those hostages still in Gaza are released immediately. Of course, we need to surge humanitarian assistance into Gaza so we can alleviate the immense suffering of Palestinian civilians who have been in harm's way through no fault of their own in a theater of war. And of course, we need to make sure that Hamas lays down its arms and that we have a government structure that is put into place that allows for normalized relations between the Palestinian people and Israel.
KRISTEN WELKER:
All right. Well, let's turn to the big news here in Washington, of course, which is the shutdown. Before lawmakers broke for the weekend, House Speaker Mike Johnson said the House would not return to Capitol Hill this week or until Leader Schumer reopens the government. When is the last time you spoke with Republican leadership?
REP. HAKEEM JEFFRIES:
Well, last time there was a conversation with Republican leadership was in the White House meeting last Monday. And unfortunately, since that point in time, Republicans, including Donald Trump, have gone radio silent. And what we've seen is negotiation through deep fake videos, the House canceling votes, and of course President Trump spending yesterday on the golf course. That's not responsible behavior. As Democrats, our view is that we will find bipartisan common ground with our Republican colleagues to reopen the government, to actually pass a spending bill that meets the needs of the American people, but we have to decisively address this Republican health care crisis that is devastating hard-working American taxpayers.
KRISTEN WELKER:
You know, Democrats are demanding an extension of Obamacare tax credits which expire at the end of the year, as well as other health care benefits for the funding bill. Here is what the vice president said about that this week. Take a look.
[BEGIN TAPE]
VICE PRES. JD VANCE:
It's a lie told by the Democrats that they're not trying to give health care benefits to illegal aliens. It's a lie that is obviously untrue if you just look at the text that they gave us.
[END TAPE]
KRISTEN WELKER:
He says that Democrats are lying. What is your response to that?
REP. HAKEEM JEFFRIES:
Well, unfortunately Republicans are lying because they're losing in the court of public opinion as it relates to what's going on right now. We are standing up for the health care of hard-working American taxpayers, of working-class Americans, of middle-class Americans, and everyday Americans who have seen over the last several months Republicans pass their One Big, Ugly Bill, largest cut to Medicaid in American history. Hospitals and nursing homes and community-based health clinics are closing all throughout the country, including in rural America. If Republicans continue to refuse to extend the Affordable Care Act tax credit, tens of millions of American taxpayers are going to experience dramatically increased premiums, copays, and deductibles. And that information from their insurance companies is going out right now. Now federal law clearly prohibits the expenditure of taxpayer dollars to provide health care to undocumented immigrants. Period, full stop. And no Democrat on Capitol Hill is trying to change that law.
KRISTEN WELKER:
But Leader Jeffries, let me ask you, because as you just mentioned, you are also calling for a complete rollback of the Medicaid cuts, which Republicans just passed. They said it's a nonstarter. Why include that? Why not just focus on your argument that you want to see those Obamacare tax credits extended, which expire at the end of the year?
REP. HAKEEM JEFFRIES:
This Republican health care crisis is all encompassing and it has been devastating to the well-being of the American people. We're talking about people in rural America, working-class America, urban America, small-town America, the heartland of America, and Black and brown communities all throughout America. Now we have made clear that in terms of what's immediately in front of us, there of course is an urgent need to address the Affordable Care Act and the Republicans' refusal to extend these tax credits. What we're talking about here is a dramatic impact on real, everyday Americans. A married couple of two, for instance, that makes $88,000 a year, a modest amount, currently pays about $8,000 a year in their health care insurance. That's already too much. But if these Affordable Care Act tax credits expire, that same couple will be forced to pay $24,000 a year. It's unaffordable. It will bankrupt them. It will leave them without coverage. And those are the people who we're fighting for.
KRISTEN WELKER:
But let me ask you, because you say this is a Republican shutdown. But it's Democratic senators who are withholding their votes on what is called a clean resolution. That means no strings attached, which is something, quite frankly, Leader, that you and other Democrats have advocated for in the past. Take a look.
[BEGIN TAPE]
REP. NANCY PELOSI:
You do not use the threat of shutting down government to try to advance your policy agenda.
SEN. HARRY REID:
First thing that the House has to do is pass a clean, six-week CR.
REP. HAKEEM JEFFRIES:
A continuing resolution that is at the fiscal year 2023 levels is the only way forward.
[END TAPE]
KRISTEN WELKER:
Why not fund the government and debate extending Obamacare tax credits after the fact? They don't expire till the end of the year.
REP. HAKEEM JEFFRIES:
Well, what we've called for is a bipartisan negotiation where Democrats and Republicans can sit down in good faith, reopen the government, pass the spending bill that actually improves the quality of life for the American people, in an environment where the cost of living is already too high. Republicans promised to lower costs on day one. Costs aren't going down, they're going up. And if these Affordable Care Act tax credits are allowed to expire, premiums and health care costs are going to skyrocket. And America is already too expensive for the American people because of the Trump failed policies, the Trump tariffs. And this will make things worse. So we just want a bipartisan negotiation that addresses the health care crisis at the same period of time with the fierce urgency of now.
KRISTEN WELKER:
Let me ask you, because the administration has personally targeted you with memes throughout this negotiation. We'll show a screenshot of one of the videos. This was put out by the president. The president also called the Democrats the party of, quote, "hate, evil and Satan." Is the president someone you still feel like you can negotiate with? Do you have that relationship with him?
REP. HAKEEM JEFFRIES:
Well, that behavior is outrageous, it's unhinged, it's unreasonable, and it speaks for itself. The American people deserve better than lies, than attacks, than deep fake videos and the president spending all of his time on the golf course. We need serious leadership. And we will continue to make clear, Leader Schumer and myself, that we will sit down any time, any place, with anyone to address this issue with the seriousness that it deserves, to stand up for the American people and addressing this cost of living crisis and this health care crisis that Republicans have visited upon the country.
KRISTEN WELKER:
All right, Leader Jeffries, thank you so much for joining us. We really appreciate it.
REP. HAKEEM JEFFRIES:
Thank you.
KRISTEN WELKER:
And joining me now is the Speaker of the House Mike Johnson of Louisiana. Mr. Speaker, welcome back to Meet the Press.
SPEAKER MIKE JOHNSON:
Thanks for having me.
KRISTEN WELKER:
Thank you so much for being here in person. Let's talk about your latest move. You announced this week that the House will not be in session until the government reopens. But there are still things that you could be doing. There are appropriations bills that you could be working on, there's a new Democratic Congresswoman who still needs to be sworn in. Isn't there still critical work that you could be doing on behalf of the American public?
SPEAKER MIKE JOHNSON:
We're doing that critical work. Let me just start by saying I listened to my friend Hakeem there, and when we used to do debate competitions in high school, they taught us to watch out for the red herring. The red herring is a distraction. Literally, everything my friend just said there was unnecessary. Because what he's trying to talk about is a December funding issue. The healthcare provisions, some of these Obamacare subsidies that expire December 31st. He is looking over entirely the fact that we have to keep the government open in order to have those bipartisan debates and discussions that he just referenced. The simple CR that we passed in the House, more than two weeks ago, does exactly that. It is a clean CR. It's only 24 pages in length. It's the simplest thing that's ever been done, and it's exactly what Chuck Schumer and Hakeem Jeffries and all the rest of them said must be done. You saw the tape. We could roll that tape for hours. All of them saying this, passionately, as recently as earlier this year, that we had to keep the government open in order to do our job.
KRISTEN WELKER:
There is, Speaker, still critical work though. And as you know, many Democrats have looked at your move. They say the House is not in session because you don't want to swear in this newly elected congresswoman, Democratic congresswoman from Arizona who would be a critical vote to releasing the Epstein files. How do you respond to that charge?
SPEAKER MIKE JOHNSON:
It's totally absurd. This has nothing to do with that. It's another red herring. The reason the government is closed is because Chuck Schumer and 43 of his Democratic colleagues in the Senate have decided now to vote multiple times to keep the government closed. We need them to turn the lights back on so that everyone can do their work. The House did our work. We passed a bipartisan, clean, continuing resolution to keep the government open. And what did Chuck Schumer send back in response? His counter proposal would add $1.5 trillion in new spending for a simple, seven-week stopgap funding measure to keep the government open so all these appropriations bills can be finished. And they want to claw back $50 billion that we put in for rural hospitals to prop them up. They're not serious. This is not a serious negotiation. They're doing this to get political cover because Chuck Schumer is afraid that he won't win his next reelection bid in the Senate because he's going to be challenged by a Marxist in New York, because that's the new popular thing out there.
KRISTEN WELKER:
Well, let me ask you about some of the issues at play here, because President Trump, the White House says it's preparing to potentially lay off, actually lay off thousands of federal workers. That's never been done before in a shutdown. Do you support laying off thousands of federal workers as a part of this shutdown?
SPEAKER MIKE JOHNSON:
We haven't seen the details yet about what's happening. But it is a regrettable situation that the president does not want.
KRISTEN WELKER:
But do you support it?
SPEAKER MIKE JOHNSON:
The president asked Chuck Schumer and Hakeem Jeffries in the Oval Office, about a week ago, "Please don't do this. Please keep the government open and we'll work out all these issues that we have plenty of time to work out."
KRISTEN WELKER:
What do you want to see though? Do you want to see thousands of federal workers laid off?
SPEAKER MIKE JOHNSON:
No. I want Chuck Schumer to do the right thing that he's done throughout his 30-plus year career in Congress and vote to keep the government open. We have to end the shutdown.
KRISTEN WELKER:
But it's never happened before. We see furloughs. We don't see layoffs though.
SPEAKER MIKE JOHNSON:
In a situation like this, where the Senate Democrats have decided to turn the keys to the kingdom over to the White House, they have to make tough decisions. Russ Vought runs the Office of Management and Budget. He has to now look at all of the federal government, recognizing that the funding streams have been turned off and determine what are essential programs, policies, and personnel. That's not a job that he relishes. But he's being required to do it by Chuck Schumer.
KRISTEN WELKER:
All right, well let me ask you about what's at the crux of this. Democrats are demanding the funding bill include an extension of the Obamacare tax credits. As we've been talking about, they're set to expire at the end of the year. More than three-quarters of the people who get health insurance through Obamacare actually live in states that President Trump won in 2024. We're talking about some 19 million people, Mr. Speaker. Can those people depend on congressional Republicans to extend those health insurance tax credits by the time they expire?
SPEAKER MIKE JOHNSON:
We have plenty of time to figure that out, because again, it doesn't expire until the end of the year.
KRISTEN WELKER:
Do you commit to that?
SPEAKER MIKE JOHNSON:
I commit to what Republicans have always done, and what we've already proven this year in the One Big Beautiful Bill, the Working Families Tax Cuts, Republicans are the ones in Congress working to improve health care access, quality, and make it cheaper. We want to bring the costs down of health care. Premiums are too high. But it's not because of Republican policies, it's because Obamacare is not working. We're trying to fix it. We've just shown in the One Big Beautiful Bill, the Working Families Tax Cut, those reforms we made to Medicaid are not cuts to Medicaid. Medicaid will continue to grow. It's just growing at a slower pace. Why? Because we've got illegal aliens and able-bodied young men without dependents off of Medicaid. They were never planned to be there in the first place. And what the Democrats are demanding right now to keep the government open, is we put them all back on there. We're not doing that.
KRISTEN WELKER:
Let's just set the table here for folks. And Leader Jeffries talked about this, but just to reiterate to you the point that he just made, undocumented immigrants, as you know, are actually ineligible for federal health care.
SPEAKER MIKE JOHNSON:
That's wrong. No, let me correct you.
KRISTEN WELKER:
But let me say it then you can talk, okay? Right now, undocumented immigrants are not eligible for federal health care programs. Democrats, as you heard, say they're not trying to change that. But one of their demands would restore Medicaid funding for hospitals to give emergency care, including to undocumented immigrants. Are you suggesting, Mr. Speaker, that ER doctors check people's immigration status before they render emergency care?
SPEAKER MIKE JOHNSON:
No. Again, it's another red herring. What the Democrats are demanding is that illegal aliens that care for them in an emergency room should be reimbursed at a higher rate.
KRISTEN WELKER:
To the hospitals.
SPEAKER MIKE JOHNSON:
To the hospitals, than American citizens, young pregnant women, they want to pay more for illegal aliens than U.S. citizens. And we are against that. The reason it's illegal right now for illegal aliens to receive taxpayer-funded benefits is because Republicans wrote it into the law July 4th. Don't take my word for it. Look at page 57, section 2141 of Chuck Schumer's counter proposal. It's on my website at Speaker.gov. Everybody go look. Don't take my word for it. Read their section. They want to reverse those changes.
KRISTEN WELKER:
But again, but first of all, a law was put in place during the Reagan administration which guarantees that anyone who walks into a hospital gets critical care.
SPEAKER MIKE JOHNSON:
EMTALA, right. It still applies.
KRISTEN WELKER:
So are you saying, because basically the implications of what you're implying is that ER doctors should be checking people's immigration status. If someone walks into a hospital and they're bleeding out, should an ER doctor not render care to that person?
SPEAKER MIKE JOHNSON:
No. It's another red herring. I'm not implying that at all. Everyone knows when the hospitals seek reimbursement from the federal government, what they did under the Biden administration is they set in place a program that pays the hospitals more for illegal aliens than U.S. citizens. That is outrageous. If you look at Speaker.gov, you can see step by step, there's five different sections of our repeals of the law we did on July 4th that Democrats are demanding to reverse right now. It will spend $200 billion of hard-working taxpayer funds to pay for health care for illegals. We're not doing it.
KRISTEN WELKER:
Yeah, but what you reference refers to lawfully present people who are here, immigrants, DACA recipients. Let me move on.
SPEAKER MIKE JOHNSON:
No.
KRISTEN WELKER:
Because we are running out of time though. I want to move on to a speech that President Trump gave earlier this week to the nation's top military leaders. Take a listen, I'll get your reaction on the other side.
[BEGIN TAPE]
PRES. DONALD TRUMP:
It seems that the ones that are run by the radical-left Democrats, what they've done to San Francisco, Chicago, New York, Los Angeles, they're very unsafe places. And we're going to straighten them out one by one. And this is going to be a major part for some of the people in this room. This is a war too. It's a war from within.
[END TAPE]
KRISTEN WELKER:
Do you support the American military being used to fight American citizens?
SPEAKER MIKE JOHNSON:
That's not what the president just said there. That's a mischaracterization of what he said. There is a war on crime.
KRISTEN WELKER:
What do you believe he said?
SPEAKER MIKE JOHNSON:
There's a war on crime. And I will use the example today, what's happened here in the District of Columbia. We're much safer. Everyone on your staff could walk from their cars to the studio this morning. Why? Because there are National Guard troops patrolling the streets. Before this, it was a literal war zone. This is one of the most dangerous cities in America. What he's saying is he's the president for law and order. He's restoring the safety of American citizens. You should not have to fear to walk to your car this afternoon. And you don't have to now, because President Trump is in charge.
KRISTEN WELKER:
You're saying it's a literal war zone. Crime was decreasing here in the nation's capital before the National Guard was set.
SPEAKER MIKE JOHNSON:
Oh really? Then why did the Democratic mayor say, "Thank you so much for bringing in the reinforcements."
KRISTEN WELKER:
Okay, but "war zone" is a different characterization. We know that the president just sent in – is saying – 300 National Guard troops will be sent into Chicago. Again, the governor saying he doesn't want that. Is this an appropriate use of the U.S. military, Mr. Speaker?
SPEAKER MIKE JOHNSON:
I don't think you should ask the governor. I think you should ask the citizens who are in fear for their lives and livelihoods in these cities.
KRISTEN WELKER:
What say you though? What say you about the use of the American military in this way in U.S. cities?
SPEAKER MIKE JOHNSON:
I've talked with National Guardsmen who are here in D.C. They're proud of the work they've done and the people here are benefiting from it greatly. Not Republicans, everybody. Because it's a safer street. This is the most, this greatest nation in the history of the world, this most beautiful capital city, it should be safe. The model here could be the model elsewhere. And in a few of these blue states, in deep blue cities that are run by soft-on-crime mayors, they need some help. The citizens need help. President Trump is a bold leader who's providing it.
KRISTEN WELKER:
All right. Worth noting that the citizens did elect the mayors and the governor.
SPEAKER MIKE JOHNSON:
Some of them regret that.
KRISTEN WELKER:
All right. House Speaker Mike Johnson, thank you for being here. Really appreciate it. When we come back, Democratic Senator Adam Schiff of California joins me next.
KRISTEN WELKER:
Welcome back. And joining me now is Democratic Senator Adam Schiff of California. Senator Schiff, welcome back to Meet the Press.
SEN. ADAM SCHIFF:
Great to be with you.
KRISTEN WELKER:
Great to have you here, thank you so much for being here. I do want to start right where I left off with the House Speaker, the government shutdown. Three of your colleagues in the Democratic Caucus have broken ranks. They voted with Republicans to keep the government open. How confident are you that Democrats will stay united in this fight?
SEN. ADAM SCHIFF:
I'm confident all Democrats understand that millions and millions of their constituents are about to be priced out of their health care. I was in California last week in Oceanside and in Anaheim. Average families of four are going to see the premiums go up by $900 to $1,000 a month. No one can afford that, and that's going to happen all across the country. So I think all my colleagues understand the crisis. We need a president who can act like an adult, who can come to the table and negotiate an end to their self-imposed health care crisis. Right now we don't see that. We see Trump out on the golf course, we see the speaker telling his House colleagues not to even come to session, that there's no work for the federal government to do, apparently. That's completely unacceptable, and in addition to the need to restore health care affordability for people, we need to make sure that any agreement that we reach with Republicans they will honor. Because right now they're telling us, "You can reach an agreement with us, but we're simply going to withhold any money that's important to you, any programs that are important to you." And as for the speaker telling you – or not telling you – his position on the president threatening the mass layoffs of federal employees, there's no one forcing him to do that. He will do that because he wants to do that, because he and Russell Vought want to cause even more pain for the American people. That is unprecedented. No other president during a shutdown has sought to maximize the harms to people, but that's where this president is coming from.
KRISTEN WELKER:
Well, let me ask you, you heard Speaker Johnson, as you're just referencing, criticize Democrats for using the government shutdown to press for an extension of those Obamacare tax subsidies. But you actually did make a similar point back in 2013, that's when Tea Party Republicans pushed to shut down the government against Obamacare. Let me play that for you, get your reaction on the other side.
[BEGIN TAPE]
REP. ADAM SCHIFF:
It's more than fair to ask the president to negotiate improvements to the Affordable Care Act, but not with the threat of shutting down the government or defaulting on our debt. It's just no way to do business and can't be allowed to proceed that way, not only for this president but for future presidents.
[END TAPE]
KRISTEN WELKER:
Senator, why is now different?
SEN. ADAM SCHIFF:
It's different in two respects. It's different because in a month or two millions of Americans are not going to be able to afford health care. So there is a crisis now that we didn't have then. The crisis is far worse now I should say than we had then. But there's another difference too, and that is that was a time where if we did agree on a continuing resolution Republicans were promising to honor it. Now they're promising not to honor it. You have the president and Russell Vought saying they're going to continue to illegally withhold money. So if we agree to a CR and nothing more they're telling us, "We don't plan to abide by it." So it is very different than it was in the past. We need both to address the health care crisis and we need some written assurance in the law. I won't take a promise that they're not going to renege on any deal we make.
KRISTEN WELKER:
Let me ask you about another matter here, Senator. I want to talk about the president's speech and Defense Secretary Pete Hegseth's speech as well to the armed forces earlier this week. I'm going to play a little bit more of what we heard from President Trump and get your reaction on the other side.
[BEGIN TAPE]
PRES. DONALD TRUMP:
And I told Pete, "We should use some of these dangerous cities as training grounds for our military, National Guard, but military."
[END TAPE]
KRISTEN WELKER:
And as I just said earlier, President Trump has now ordered 300 National Guard troops to Chicago over the objections of the Illinois governor. How should Democrats respond? What can you do? What recourse do you have?
SEN. ADAM SCHIFF:
I mean, first of all the president was being candid when he described these American cities as "the enemy within.” He views them as the enemy within. That is unprecedented, and it's dangerous. That is that an American president views cities that didn't support him or states that didn't support him as the enemy, that he describes the opposite party as beholden to Satan. That's where this president is coming from. And the idea that we will militarize these cities, that we will impose the U.S. military on the mayors and governors of those cities and states should be unthinkable. And for Speaker Johnson to claim as he did when you interviewed him that somehow these National Guard troops, that, over the governor's opposition, are being forced to engage in policing or immigration enforcement are very happy to be doing it. I can tell you in California the National Guard were not happy to be doing it. It is, I think, greatly impacting morale in the National Guard, and it is also disrupting the trust that Americans have for their National Guard. We have a particular bond in California where they come to our rescue during fires and floods and other natural disasters. That is being eroded as I think is also military readiness when we're diverting military resources for these improper purposes.
KRISTEN WELKER:
Let me turn to another topic.
SEN. ADAM SCHIFF:
But on remedies –
KRISTEN WELKER:
Yes.
SEN. ADAM SCHIFF:
The only remedy we have is litigation, and as we just saw in Portland where a judge struck down their ability to misuse troops this way, it is an effective remedy although the Supreme Court is still very much in doubt in terms of whether they will uphold or strike this down.
KRISTEN WELKER:
Well, you raised the judicial system, you take me to my next question. Former FBI Director James Comey was, as you know, indicted five days after President Trump posted this to his attorney general, Pam Bondi. Let me read it and remind our viewers. Quote, "Pam, I have reviewed over 30 statements and posts saying that, essentially, same old story as last time, all talk, no action, nothing is being done. What about Comey? Adam ‘Shifty’ Schiff, Leticia??? They're all guilty as hell, but nothing is going to be done." Given how quickly the Justice Department moved to press criminal charges against James Comey, are you concerned, Senator, that you could be next?
SEN. ADAM SCHIFF:
Well first of all, the Republican U.S. Attorney in Virginia refused to go forward with this prosecution of James Comey because he thought it lacked evidence. They fired him. They fired him and replaced him with a personal lawyer of the president, an insurance lawyer, to seek these charges. That is unheard of. I almost spent – I spent almost six years in the Justice Department, never saw anything remotely like this. And for the president to on social media badger his Attorney General to go after people, you know, let me just say this. Because it's connected to your previous question about the enemy within. He's described me as the enemy within. He's described other Democratic elected officials as the enemy within. He is using the Justice Department to go after his political enemies, and he's using the Justice Department to protect his political friends like Tom Homan, the border czar, who reportedly took $50,000 in cash from undercover FBI agents, and they made the case go away. This should concern every American, not just those he's tweeting about like myself, but anyone who cares about whether the Justice Department can be used against people for expressing their views, or doing their job, or holding the president accountable. Anyone who cares about whether the administration can go after late night comedians, or tell corporations who they can hire, or tell law firms who they can represent. It is all part of the same attack on our democracy. And I'll say, if this goes on, if Republicans allow this to go on for four years, there will be nothing left of our democracy. We have an opportunity to stop this. It would require just a handful of Republicans of conscience to oppose these lawless actions, this abuse of the Justice Department and abuse of the FEC and everything else. We need them to stand up and do their duty.
KRISTEN WELKER:
Senator Adam Schiff, thank you so much for being here.
SEN. ADAM SCHIFF:
Thank you.
KRISTEN WELKER:
We really appreciate it. And when we come back, President Trump's message to the hundreds of military leaders and how it compares to the Pentagon of the past. Our Meet the Press Minute is next.
KRISTEN WELKER:
Welcome back. This week President Trump and Defense Secretary Pete Hegseth spoke before an unprecedented gathering of more than 800 generals and admirals where President Trump suggested American cities should be used as training grounds for the military, and said the U.S. should project more military power. But in the wake of the September 11th attacks, Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld struck a different note. He joined Meet the Press to discuss the tension between war and defense.
[BEGIN TAPE]
TIM RUSSERT:
Many people have commented that for the first eight months as Secretary of Defense you seem to be insular, detached. But since September 11th as Secretary of War you've been energized. You think that's fair?
SEC. DONALD RUMSFELD:
Oh, I don't know. It's not for me to judge. We had a lot of complicated things to deal with. This institution, the Department of Defense, is so central to peace and stability in the world, and to our economy. And it's the underpinning of our economy. We don't have a healthy economic situation in the world absent peace and stability. So how we behave is enormously important, and we must transform this institution. We cannot simply hang on to the capabilities that were appropriate in a prior century. We need to think things anew, we need to take steps that are bold, and innovative, and that will position us so that we can continue to provide peace and stability in the period ahead.
[END TAPE]
KRISTEN WELKER:
And when we come back, how long will the government shutdown last? And is the war in Gaza nearing its end? The panel is next.
KRISTEN WELKER:
Welcome back. The panel is here. Andrea Mitchell, NBC News Chief Foreign Affairs Correspondent and Chief Washington Correspondent; Ryan Nobles, NBC News Chief Capitol Hill Correspondent; Neera Tanden, president and CEO of the Center for American Progress; and Marc Short, former Trump director of legislative affairs. Thank you all for being here on an incredibly busy Sunday. Andrea, let me start with you. I know you've been working your sources on this 20-point plan of the president's, you heard what the secretary of state had to say. Where do you see this going from here? Could this in fact be the end of the war in Gaza?
ANDREA MITCHELL:
Potentially. This is such a big deal. Look, if they get the hostages out, as the Secretary said, that is the top priority, but then comes the hard part. You've got Hamas that has not agreed to disarm. You've got Israel which has not set a timetable for withdrawal and is now taking more land from Gaza in a buffer zone than anyone had contemplated. So all of this is to be negotiated. They are now in Egypt negotiating. Steve Witkoff, Jared Kushner, and talking to Hamas. Hamas is divided between the military and the political branches. But the important thing is that Hamas is now really isolated. The Arab countries all came together in New York when they were here for the UN meetings with the president, that is a huge factor. And partly that's because of Israel's biggest mistake which was to attack Qatar. This united the Arab world, it infuriated President Trump. For the first time we're seeing President Trump really putting pressure on Netanyahu to stop the bombing. When he said that, it was very significant. So this could be transformational and, you know, if this were to work out and, you know, it would be the Abraham Accords, it would be recognition of Israel, transform the whole region. And President Trump would deserve that Nobel Prize.
KRISTEN WELKER:
Wow. Certainly, it's something that he has certainly, according to folks who are close to him, has been eyeing. Marc, Andrea makes, I think, a really critical point here which is that after Israel targeted Hamas in Qatar there was that backlash. President Trump was infuriated. He had Prime Minister Netanyahu call the Qataris to apologize –
MARC SHORT:
Right.
KRISTEN WELKER:
What does this moment say about the state of the relationship between President Trump and Prime Minister Netanyahu?
MARC SHORT:
Well, as Andrea said, this could be a giant breakthrough. And I think the President has stood behind Israel throughout both his first and second terms, he deserves credit for that, but there is strain there. I mean, we have to keep in mind, the reality that the reason the bombing happened is because Qatar has housed Hamas' terrorists before. That's the only reason there is for bombing them in the first place. And so, you know, as you look to this deal I think there's a lot that still has to play out. Giving up 1,700 terrorist hostages from Israel, basically create a potential pathway to statehood, because of an invasion two years ago that slaughtered Israelis, there's a lot here that still has to play out.
KRISTEN WELKER:
No doubt. We're going to track every twist and turn closely as we tracking every twist and turn here in Washington. Ryan Nobles with that I turn to you. We heard from the Speaker of the House, we heard from the minority leader, both sides seem as dug in as ever this morning.
RYAN NOBLES:
Yeah.
KRISTEN WELKER:
Where are we in this battle to reopen the government?
RYAN NOBLES:
Well, I think it says something that the closest these two men had gotten to talking in a room is through your show this morning. They're debating about this in public, they're not having serious negotiations behind closed doors, and that's why I think this shutdown is going to take a little bit longer than anybody had originally anticipated. The biggest thing right now is about the moderate Democrats in the Senate, right? They were the ones that broke in the spring. I remember standing outside of a room on Capitol Hill where we literally heard them screaming at each other as to whether or not they should hold ground and stand up to Donald Trump. That's not happening now. That moderate middle is holding. It could have something to do with the fact that folks like Gary Peters, Jeanne Shaheen, are not running for reelection. They can stand up to Trump without consequence, but right now Democrats are unified, and that's why this shutdown's going to continue.
KRISTEN WELKER:
Neera, will they continue to hold? You have Congresswoman Alexandra Ocasio-Cortez of the progressive base of the Democratic Party cheering on Chuck Schumer and Hakeem Jeffries, but to Ryan's point it's all about the moderates in the middle.
NEERA TANDEN:
Absolutely. And I think the moderates see a world in which, The Wall Street Journal has leaks that Donald Trump and the White House are concerned about the premium tax credits, Josh Hawley, they're concerned that they have to actually deal with this problem. Josh Hawley puts out quotes basically saying Republicans have to deal with this, and Senator Thune's position is, and as you heard, Mike Johnson's, "We'll deal with this," but actually after people get their notices. And I think that's what's so odd about this posture. Because honestly this is a real problem people are facing. People have talked about the fact that 75% of the people who are going to get the real shocks are in Republican states, and they are paying at the very least doubling of their premiums. And I think fundamentally this is a cost of living issue and the American people want it solved.
KRISTEN WELKER:
Marc, a majority of people are saying they want to see these Obamacare tax credits extended. To what extent is that a pressure point on the White House?
MARC SHORT:
Well, look. I think sadly Republicans are going to cave on this in the end.
KRISTEN WELKER:
You do?
MARC SHORT:
Oh, of course. The bottom line, Kristen, is that look, the Democrats were really shrewd when they put the Obamacare subsidies in the plan. It bought off insurance to support Obamacare. No surprise the government takes our health care, prices go up, and so here we are 100% increase in prices, and basically you have Democrats and Republicans. and Republicans are opposed to any free market reforms, eventually they're going to do this, but Democrats caused the shutdown. But can I also say in your interview with Leader Jeffries, if we stop with the pearl-clutching about the mean tweets, and sombrero tweets – that this week it came to light that a Democratic candidate for Attorney General in the state of Virginia called for the assassination of a political opponent, called for the assassination of that political opponent's family, and there's not one national Democrat calling for him to step aside, not one. It's disgraceful.
KRISTEN WELKER:
Neera, let me let you respond to that, because that is going to be a big story I think in the coming days. And then we'll go to Andrea.
NEERA TANDEN:
I mean, I absolutely think people should criticize that, 100%.
KRISTEN WELKER:
Yeah.
NEERA TANDEN:
I think it was a private conversation he had, but still awful and disgusting.
ANDREA MITCHELL:
And it should be –
NEERA TANDEN:
I think he wasn’t calling for it in public –
ANDREA MITCHELL
– it should be condemned.
NEERA TANDEN:
– and it should be condemned. But then we should condemn that, but then you should condemn when the president calls the Democratic party the party of Satan.
MARC SHORT:
Yeah, in all fairness –
NEERA TANDEN:
– why don't we just say both of those things are –
MARC SHORT:
Okay, I think in all fairness, I think I've paid the price for political violence on our side.
KRISTEN WELKER:
But –
NEERA TANDEN:
Yeah. I agree with that.
MARC SHORT:
And I –
NEERA TANDEN:
Then let's criticize other Republicans or the president for not saying–
MARC SHORT:
I think I clearly have. I think I clearly have. But the fact that not one Democrat has said that when he called --
NEERA TANDEN:
Well I’m saying it.
MARC SHORT:
– for a political assassination in this moment of political violence is crazy.
KRISTEN WELKER:
Andrea, talk about that this is the fraught backdrop against which they're trying to reopen the government.
ANDREA MITCHELL:
Well, first of all they're not talking. And I've never seen a shutdown in the, you know, how many decades have we seen shutdowns, where they don't even talk, and that is not acceptable. But I don't think the Democrats are going to cave on this, because their view is, the president is already violating previous precedents in the Supreme Court by taking appropriated money and moving it around, and firing people, and shutting down departments. So the threat to fire, which I thought would be the real nuclear weapon on the power of the –
KRISTEN WELKER:
Yeah.
ANDREA MITCHELL:
– administration isn't working because Democratic workers are saying, "We're being fired anyway."
KRISTEN WELKER:
Ryan, ten seconds left.
RYAN NOBLES:
This is all about Donald Trump. When Donald Trump decides that he doesn't want to deal with the shutdown anymore, he runs the Republican Senate and House right now. If he says, "Guys, make a deal," they will make a deal. We'll just see how long it will take to get there.
NEERA TANDEN:
That's what Mike Johnson should worry about.
KRISTEN WELKER:
We will indeed. Guys, great conversation, thank you. That is all for today. Thank you so much for watching. We will be back next week because if it's Sunday, it's Meet the Press.
