Guest: Terry Jeffrey, Carson Daly, Jenna Woods, Bob Lahita
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GEORGE W. BUSH, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: The delegation will be led by Secretary of State Colin Powell and Governor Jeb Bush, who has extensive experience in the state of Florida with relief, rehabilitation, and reconstruction efforts following natural disasters.
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JOE SCARBOROUGH, HOST: Tonight‘s top headline, President Bush sends the secretary of state and Florida Governor Jeb Bush to South Asia.
Welcome to SCARBOROUGH COUNTRY, where no passport is required and only common sense is allowed.
The death tolls climbed even higher, now close to 120,000 dead. And worries arising about disease which could double that death toll. And the harrowing stories of the survivors who narrowly escaped the flooding. You are going to be hearing those accounts firsthand from the lucky people who made it home alive. And you will hear it in their own words.
Plus, as more relief supplies are starting to arrive, President Bush continues to come under fire by some who believe his offer of $35 million in aid is too little, too late.
ANNOUNCER: From the press room, to the courtroom, to the halls of Congress, Joe Scarborough has seen it all. Welcome back to SCARBOROUGH COUNTRY.
SCARBOROUGH: Hey, welcome to the show. I‘m Joe Scarborough. I hope you and your family are getting ready for a safe and happy New Year‘s Eve and a great new year.
But, obviously, halfway across the world, there is nobody talking about a new year, nobody talking about next year. They are concerned about living past next week. Tonight, the death toll in that area climbs toward 120,000. The relief is beginning to pour in, but, you know, in many places, destroyed roads are making it impossible to get help to people who so desperately need it.
NBC‘s James Hattori Standing by right now in Colombo, Sri Lanka, and he has got the latest for us.
James, what do you got?
JAMES HATTORI, NBC CORRESPONDENT: Joe, it‘s Friday here in Sri Lanka, a national day of mourning in recognition of the tragic events from Sunday from the tsunami.
And the death toll continues to climb, not a surprise, especially when you look at footage like this. This is some home video that was taken at a hotel in Phuket on Sunday in Thailand, a resort area that was so badly devastated. You can see guests there clinging to whatever they can as these waters rush past them, literally holding on for dear life.
No surprise, too, that today, when there were new tsunami alerts issued in Thailand and India, as well as Sri Lanka, people ran for the hills again, tens of thousands of them. It turns out it was an aftershock of 5.5 to 6 on the Richter scale, but not strong enough to create any sort of tsunami problems, so a false alarm, but people obviously still very skittish about that kind of thing.
Meantime, another frustrating day on the relief effort front. There were helicopter aerial drops into some remote areas of supplies, but not enough to satisfy so many people and so many needs. There are an estimated five million people without the basic necessities, water and food and medicine, to survive for the next days and weeks.
So, the challenge is still very big. On the island of Sumatra, supplies are stacked up at airports, but they can‘t get them to the remote areas because the roads are closed or the gas is not available for cars or cars are not even available. But U.N. officials and relief officials say that the pace of the delivery is picking up.
They say that the problem is, the devastation is so widespread, communities are so isolated. It‘s a big challenge, but the international effort, they say, is gathering steam. And that, of course, is the best kind of news that the people who are in such dire need can hear at this point.
Joe, that‘s the latest here—back to you.
SCARBOROUGH: All right, thanks so much, James.
Now, the longer it takes to get relief to the affected areas, the more chance that disease is going to take many, many more lives.
NBC‘s chief science correspondent Robert Bazell now with more on that.
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ROBERT BAZELL, NBC CHIEF SCIENCE CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The waves hit some of the poorest countries on Earth, where public health systems, already weak, are now overwhelmed.
DR. DAVID NABARRO, WORLD HEALTH ORGANIZATION: There is a chance that we could have at least as many dying from communicable diseases as we‘ve had dying from the tsunami.
BAZELL: The biggest danger, the lack of sanitary drinking water, supplies contaminated by seawater, and human waste.
DR. IRWIN REDLENER, COLUMBIA UNIVERSITY: Once the water supply gets contaminated, especially with sewage, then waterborne diseases like cholera, like dysentery, can become rampant.
BAZELL: Exploding mosquito populations could bring outbreaks of malaria and dengue fever, while the millions of homeless face potential epidemics of flu and other respiratory infections.
(on camera): To try to lesson the disease threat, officials here at the United Nations are working to coordinate one of the largest, most logistically complicated relief efforts in peacetime history.
(voice-over): The priorities, chlorine tablets and other means of providing fresh water, equipment to bury dead humans and animals, mobile clinics to treat the injured, antibiotics for disease outbreaks, shelter for the homeless.
How critical is the effort? In 1976, an earthquake in Guatemala killed 23,000 people. But officials estimate three times that many died from disease outbreaks that followed. By contrast, Hurricane Andrew in 1992, one of the largest natural disasters to strike the U.S., destroyed hospitals, knocked out power, water, and sanitation facilities. But the response was rapid and immense.
REDLENER: Almost within hours, and certainly within days, we had reestablished a health care infrastructure in Southern Florida and very few lives were lost as a consequence of that.
BAZELL: The speed that relief supplies arrive in the wake of the tsunami will decide whether thousands more live or die.
Robert Bazell, NBC News, New York.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SCARBOROUGH: Now, as you heard, they are warning that the death toll could double or even triple due to disease.
With me now to talk about that very frightening thought is Dr. Bob Lahita. He‘s the chairman of medicine at the Jersey City Medical Center.
Dr. Lahita, thank you so much for joining us.
And I heard in Robert Bazell‘s report, he talked about the earthquake in Guatemala in 1976 and talked about how three times the number of people died not from the earthquake, but from the aftereffects of the earthquake because of disease. Is there any possibility of that here, where we could see 100,000, possibly 200,000 people, dying from the aftereffects of this tsunami?
DR. BOB LAHITA, JERSEY CITY MEDICAL CENTER: Yes, this is a catastrophe, Joe. This is a catastrophe beyond belief, because we could see three times or more the number dying from diseases, waterborne diseases as was mentioned, mosquito-borne diseases in particular, like malaria and dengue.
But then you have these bacterial organisms, like the salmonellas, which cause typhoid. We have typhoid fever that can begin. Because of all the decomposing bodies and the inability to bury them fast enough, these diseases become rampant and spread through the population like a fire. Without clear and without good drinking water, we run the risk of having a major catastrophe, even worse than what we are already seeing. And then you have to remember...
SCARBOROUGH: And, Doctor.
LAHITA: Yes, Joe.
SCARBOROUGH: No, I was just going to say, Doctor, I understand, with cholera, somebody could actually get that disease, it could come on so strong, so severely, that they could actually be dead in an hour or two, and then you have more bodies piling up, more disease spreading. How do we stop that in a region so remote?
LAHITA: Well, that‘s what the difficulty is here, Joe.
The cholera is extremely deadly, especially in a catastrophe like this, where one can lose several times their entire body fluid. Unless there‘s fluid going back into the patient that has the cholera, they become dehydrated and die within hours, as you mentioned. We also have...
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LAHITA: Joe, go ahead.
SCARBOROUGH: Keep going. No, you go.
(CROSSTALK)
LAHITA: We also have a problem with basic medical care. You‘ve got to remember that there are six million people without a hospital. Of that six million, there are hundreds of thousands with diabetes, with heart disease, congestive heart failure. All those people run the risk of dying as well, not just those from transmissible diseases.
SCARBOROUGH: All right, Dr. Bob Lahita, thank you very much for being with us tonight and filling us in. And I ask you, if you will, to please come back to SCARBOROUGH COUNTRY in the coming days and weeks, as we continue to follow this story, because you are right. The real tragedy of this is that this death toll may double or triple by the time it‘s all over. Thanks for being with us tonight, Doctor.
LAHITA: Thank you, Joe.
SCARBOROUGH: Now, if you want to help the nations that have been hit by the tsunami, we have posted just a few of the organizations that are providing relief. And you can find them at our home Web site, Joe.MSNBC.com.
Now, if it weren‘t bad enough, today, tens of thousands of people in the region were told to flee what was left of their homes and communities. They had been warned that powerful aftershocks, measuring as high as seven on the Richter scale, could lead to even more devastating tsunamis. But those waves never came.
It made some wonder about the warning system. Could lives have actually been saved if it had been used last week?
Well, here‘s Kerry Sanders on that sensor system that some people do say could save your life.
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KERRY SANDERS, NBC CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The death toll could have been much less. Three years ago, U.S. scientists spearheaded a global effort to establish a tsunami warning system. It was built in the Pacific, but the money to put it elsewhere is still not in place.
Dr. Eddie Bernard led the team that developed the technology.
DR. EDDIE BERNARD, DIRECTOR, PACIFIC MARINE ENVIRONMENTAL LABORATORY:
It was laid out in a way that we hoped that countries would embrace it because it was low-tech enough that they could participate, yet high-tech enough to actually make a difference.
SANDERS: Here‘s how it works. Each buoy is tethered to the ocean floor. Nearby, a sensor is anchored which measures an earthquake and the resulting ripple effect from the weight of the water. Here‘s what it sounds like. That data is then transmitted to a satellite.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The magnitude nine starts right here.
SANDERS: Within moments, scientists at the Pacific Tsunami Warning Center in Hawaii can determine the location and size of the tsunami and who needs to be warned. Would it work?
CONRAD LAUTENBACHER, NOAA: The analogy I would use is the advent of weather satellites. If you will remember, our ability to predict hurricanes prior to those satellites, it was very chancy. Today, we have very accurate predictions and the loss of lives has gone from thousands into the single digits. The dark buoy technology has the same potential for preventing loss of lives from tsunamis.
SANDERS: Scientists say it would take only 50 buoys at a cost of about $20 million a year over the next decade to finish the network.
The president:
BUSH: And it seems like to me it makes sense for the world to come together to develop a warning system that will help all nations.
SANDERS (on camera): Fifty-three nations and the European Union are involved in an effort to establish a network and share scientific data, a so-called global earth observation system that proponents envision could some day also reduce famines, eliminate epidemics, and along the world‘s shores, save lives.
Kerry Sanders, NBC News, Miami.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SCARBOROUGH: What a tragedy that this actually could have been prevented, if people would have just listened to U.S. scientists a few years ago.
Now, when we come back, a firsthand account from a woman who was caught in disaster.
Plus, President Bush has taken some hits for not speaking out quickly enough about the tsunami. Should he have responded sooner? We are going to have that debate when SCARBOROUGH COUNTRY returns.
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UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It sounded like a jet engine just right—maybe five feet behind you, people screaming as moving water hit them, and just trees cracking, houses floating. And it was just so horrible.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
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SCARBOROUGH: Up next on SCARBOROUGH COUNTRY, the amazing story of survival from one woman who literally had to outrun a tidal wave and narrowly escaped the flooding.
That‘s when SCARBOROUGH COUNTRY returns.
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JAKE KING, TSUNAMI SURVIVOR: It was just tough seeing people who weren‘t strong enough to get on a tree. And we did everything we could to grab people, but the water was just so powerful that you can only hold onto people so long.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCARBOROUGH: You know, for every story of survival, there‘s a family member desperately searching for a loved one.
And Adrian Britton of ITN is Phuket, Thailand, where forensics could actually find the answers that these families so desperately need.
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ADRIAN BRITTON, ITN REPORTER (voice-over): It was not a dramatic crash of wave which killed so many. As this latest video shows, the tsunami was a mighty push of sea, a constant force consuming every object and person in its path.
A man clambers to safety on what was, a few seconds before, a first-floor balcony. And a family at the hotel in Kamala Bay looked dazed as they struggled to stay together. Five days on and they come to collect their dead. This is an outdoor mortuary in Krabi where the victims, both Thai and foreign tourists, are laid out for identification by relatives. Outside, Westerners wearing masks to hide the stench of death, view photographs of the deceased, many severely disfigured.
(on camera): It is nothing short of horrific for friends and relatives to see. Some of the bodies behind me have been laid out in the open heat for several days. Visual identification is now virtually impossible. It will have to be done forensically.
(voice-over): British missing and presumed dead—Lincoln Abraham, who‘s on Phi Phi Beach, today, his friends viewed the mortuary photographs on a computer, an agonizing duty.
Where recognition of corpses is impossible, close family has to give DNA samples to establish identity. This young man believes he may have found the body of his younger sister. It is a necessary forensic formality so the body can be released. But in their grief, it is one more unbearable task to go through before they can take their loved ones home.
Adrian Britton, ITV News, Thailand.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SCARBOROUGH: Now some good news. Jenna Woods is grateful to be alive tonight. She was in the Sri Lanka resort town of Tota (ph) when the first waves hit. Tonight, she joins us from her hometown in Ohio.
Jenna, thanks for being with us.
And I know it‘s got to be hard, but, if you can, take us through the first moments before the tidal wave hit.
JENNA WOODS, TSUNAMI SURVIVOR: Sure. I would love to. I am actually from Rhode Island, though.
Anyway, the first moments when the tidal wave hit, my brother and I were actually in the hotel room sleeping, so the hotel that we were staying at was high on a hill. So, fortunately, the water did not rise so high that it came into our hotel, but it certainly came into hotels in the surrounding area, not far from where we are staying at all.
So, we didn‘t realize that anything had even happened until our driver came to get us early that day. We were scheduled to leave Sri Lanka that day. And he came to get us early because of the flood. So...
SCARBOROUGH: What was the scene like as you looked out your hotel room window, as you went onto the grounds and inspected what was going on?
WOODS: Well, we tried to leave around 10:00 in the morning, but we were unable to because a wall had collapsed into the road. There was a boat in the road blocking the way, so we couldn‘t get out. There was, you know, just flooding in the area, a lot of debris on the ground from the tidal wave.
There were chairs, lawn chairs, upside down in trees. And the water had to go a considerable force and height in order to get over this wall and to collapse it, so it was very upsetting to see how strong it must have been when it did hit to cause that kind of devastation.
SCARBOROUGH: Jenna, we see these pictures of death and destruction coming out of the area where you were. And, obviously, roads have been washed out. And it‘s been next to impossible for people to get out of there. How did you make your journey from your hotel back to the United States?
WOODS: Well, fortunately, we had the most incredible driver there is. He insisted upon getting us out. We tried to leave around 10:30, but, like I said earlier, we were unable to do so because a wall had collapsed. They used manpower to move some of the wall out of the way, so that we were able to leave a couple hours later.
And we found out, after we were safely into Colombo that, about 15 minutes after we left, the second wave hit that area, which was much worse than the first, so we were so fortunate that we escaped when we did. We ended up missing our flight that day, however, so we did stay an extra night in Colombo and left the next day.
We went actually back to Bahrain, where my brother lives and works as a defense contractor for the Army. So we flew back there on the 27th.
(CROSSTALK)
SCARBOROUGH: It sounds like your driver may have saved your life by getting you out there as quickly as possible, before the second and larger wave came.
WOODS: Exactly.
SCARBOROUGH: Well, Jenna, thanks a lot. Yes, thanks a lot for being with us tonight. We are so grateful that you are home safely.
And of the thousands of people still missing out of the tsunami disaster, U.N. officials have said that up to a third of the victims could be children.
But, as NBC‘s Kevin Sites reports, in Thailand, there are also some rays of hope.
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KEVIN SITES, NBC CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): This is one of the happy endings, 2-year-old Hans Bergstrom (ph) of Sweden reunited with his father in Thailand. The so-called miracle child was found unconscious on top of a hill after the tsunami struck.
They were brought together again after the hospital staff posted details on the Internet. Of the thousands of people still missing in this tragedy, many are believed to be children pulled from their parents‘ grasp by a ferocious sea. And in the disaster, where the human toll has nearly reached the point of incomprehension, the images of dead and missing children may be the most heartbreaking of all.
MARION VOSS, GERMAN TOURIST: All the time, when I go back to Germany, I find my mother.
SITES: This photograph of a young boy Karl Nilsson was taken on a street corner in Phuket as he desperately searched for his father, mother, and brothers, all washed away by the tsunami.
(on camera): Relief agencies say more children, possibly tens of thousands, could become the victims of the secondary effects of disease and malnutrition.
CAROL BELLAMY, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR, UNICEF: Because they are closer to the ground, because their bodies are less well developed, they probably have been more subject to both physical harm, as well as the potential of diseases.
SITES (voice-over): There is great concern that decaying bodies could poison the water supply, unleashing everything from dysentery to cholera. Children would be the most vulnerable.
It will be a massive effort, requiring enormous resources, but the alternative, a possible doubling of the current death toll, is even more unthinkable, especially when so many of the statistics could look like this.
Kevin Sites, NBC News, Phuket, Thailand.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SCARBOROUGH: Thank you, Kevin.
Now, coming up, help is on the way to areas hit hard by the tsunamis. Governor Jeb Bush and Colin Powell are heading over there. But is the president‘s offer of help too little too late?
That debate coming up next when SCARBOROUGH COUNTRY returns.
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SCARBOROUGH: Up next on SCARBOROUGH COUNTRY, was President Bush‘s offer of $35 million in aid to Asia too little too late? That debate is coming up next.
But, first, let‘s get the latest headlines from the MSNBC News Desk.
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ANNOUNCER: From the press room, to the courtroom, to the halls of Congress, Joe Scarborough has seen it all. Welcome back to SCARBOROUGH COUNTRY.
SCARBOROUGH: Hey, welcome back to the show.
Now, as you know, aftershocks are continuing to shake South Asia. And jittery survivors are fleeing coastal communities everywhere, fearing another wave of deadly tsunamis. And the latest estimate puts the death toll of this natural disaster at more than 120,000.
Brooke Hart brings us the latest report from Washington.
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
BROOKE HART, NBC CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The undersea aftershock sent panicked residents inland, fearing more flooding. That would only hold up getting aid to survivors who need it most.
Today, international aid poured into Thailand, to Indonesia and to India. Some 60 countries have pledged a quarter billion dollars to a part of the world where little is left standing. Three days after the quake, President Bush in Texas stressed a U.S. commitment to help.
BUSH: We are committed to helping the affected countries in the difficult weeks and months that lie ahead.
HART: The U.S. has pledged $35 million so far, a sum the U.S. spends in four hours each day in Iraq. And American air and seas power are en route. The Pentagon has sent seven ships, including the USS Abraham Lincoln, all able to make 90,000 gallons of fresh water a day.
And more amateur video shows what struck Sunday without warning. This was in Malaysia, a father videotaping his children playing on the beach and then running from waves that swallowed the coastline and everything on it. The United Nations fears a third of the victims are children, more vulnerable, too, in the aftermath.
BELLAMY: Because they are closer to the ground, because their bodies are less well developed, they probably have been more subject to both physical harm, as well as the potential of diseases.
HART: With that threat, health officials predict a second wave of death potentially doubling an already staggering human toll.
In Washington, Brooke Hart, NBC News.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SCARBOROUGH: So the big question right now Washington is whether the president failed in leadership since Sunday‘s tsunami.
With us tonight to talk about this is Terry Jeffrey. Terry is the editor of “Human Events.”
Now, Terry, you heard in this report two points, the first being that we want to talk about is the fact that it took President Bush three days to come on his Texas ranch and talk to the American people and the world to express his concern about the earthquake and the tsunami that followed. Why would the president wait 72 hours to respond to one of the greatest disasters of our time?
TERRY JEFFREY, EDITOR, “HUMAN EVENTS”: Well, I think, first of all, Joe, he responded correctly. I think a lot of the criticism we have seen directed at the president and the United States‘ efforts is either in some cases motivated by anti-Americanism.
In other cases, it‘s people who have a political axe to grind against the president. I don‘t really believe there are people out there who think that the president of the United States wants to withhold any help or assistance we can give to the people of South Asia at this time of horrific tragedy. I think we all know that the president, that our government, that our country wants to do everything we can to help the people who have been affected by this horrible act of nature. And...
(CROSSTALK)
SCARBOROUGH: But, Terry, wait one second. But, Terry, what is the president doing, though, sitting in his ranch home on vacation for three days? Couldn‘t he have gone out the day after it hit and said, you know what, we are gathering all the information, but I just want to know that all of America‘s hearts and prayers are with these people right now going through this terrible time?
JEFFREY: Sure, that would have been a nice gesture, Joe, but I don‘t think there‘s any reason to try and politically second-guess what the president did.
I think that, first of all, if you look at a lot of the—the man who originally made the criticism that the—quote, unquote—“rich countries were stingy,” I don‘t know if I am going to pronounce his name country, but it‘s Jan Egeland—E-G-E-L-A-N-D.
He‘s a Norwegian U.N. official. The very next day, he took it back, Joe. But after he took it back and the United States and other Western countries were pouring aid as fast as they could and as effectively as they could into this region, you saw editorials and commentaries coming out and politically attacking the president of the United States.
Some of those editorials, Joe, raised the issue of level of government-to-government foreign aid that the U.S. provides to some of these regimes around the world, as if there‘s some sort of logical connection between handouts to authoritarian, in some cases totalitarian regimes in other parts of the world and U.S. effort to help people in time of tragedy.
Joe, one of the things the president pointed out yesterday is that, last year, the United States government gave $2.4 billion in humanitarian disaster assistance.
(CROSSTALK)
JEFFREY: That was 40 percent of the world‘s total, Joe.
SCARBOROUGH: Obviously, we are a very giving country. These questions relate to the president and the way he responded. I do want to talk about a point you just brought up, though, about that 40 percent number.
You know, a government official this morning told “The New York Times” this—quote—“American funds for disaster relief alone were $2.4 billion last year, 40 percent of the worldwide contributions for this purpose.” And the official added that the United States is the largest donor in the world, by far.
But, of course, Terry, that didn‘t stop the editorial page of “The New York Times” from printing this quip under the headline, “Are We Stingy? Yes.” And this is what “The Times” editorial page said: “Mr. Bush yesterday said that the $35 million that we‘ve now pledged is only the beginning of the United States recovery effort. Let‘s hope that is true.”
Obviously, “Times,” they‘re going to always attack the president. But what do you say to this reporter that just filed the report for NBC, and I have seen other people on their blogs saying, hey, you Americans aren‘t doing that much? After all—here is the exact amount—the money that you are giving, that $35 million, you pay that every day in Iraq every four hours. What is your response?
JEFFREY: Well, first of all, I think it‘s mixing apples and oranges again.
That “New York Times” editorial, by the way, it was one that talked about the U.S. level of foreign aid to foreign governments, which in no way is going to help these people here. The appropriate comparison was that $2.4 billion the president was talking about. But, yes, we fought a military engagement in Afghanistan. We have one going on in Iraq now. Those military engagements are very expensive. Part of the reason they are expensive, Joe, is because of the respect for innocent human life that the United States has.
We take great care to develop weapons systems that do not have collateral damage to innocent people in time of war. We risk casualties with our troops on the ground. As, for example, in Fallujah, the way we went in there, we risked our own men in order to minimize damage to innocent life. I defy anyone to say there‘s any country in the world that is superior to the United States in protecting innocent life.
And let me add one other thing, Joe. All this has been a discussion of how much aid the United States government is going to give. And, by the way, there are U.S. Navy warships on their way to this region right now that are going to purify water, bring doctors and medicine.
But there‘s another story happening today. The private contributions of American citizens to independent aid organizations that are developed to precisely aid people in this kind of tragedy, huge amounts of dollars are coming from private citizens out of their own hearts, out of their own pockets into these organizations today because of the generosity of the American people.
SCARBOROUGH: All right, Terry Jeffrey, you are exactly right. Last year, the American people gave $34 billion for these efforts privately, not through any federal government, which is 10 times the amount of the entire U.N. budget.
Hey, Terry, by the way, I agree with you on everything you said. We invited Congressman Gregory Meeks to come on the show. Unfortunately, he was delayed and couldn‘t make it. I just had to play devil‘s advocate with you tonight.
JEFFREY: OK, Joe.
SCARBOROUGH: Thanks for being with us tonight. As always, we greatly appreciate your contribution.
JEFFREY: Thank you, Joe.
SCARBOROUGH: Now, coming up next, Carson Daly enters SCARBOROUGH COUNTRY. And he is going to give us his list of the best and worst moments in Hollywood in 2004 and also talk about how Hollywood stars are taking a shortcut.
And from a reelection of a president to the loss of a former president, my year-end review of the biggest stories, that‘s all coming up next in SCARBOROUGH COUNTRY.
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SCARBOROUGH: You know, like I said, we were supposed to have New York Congressman Gregory Meeks on to debate Terry Jeffrey. It was awfully hard for me to play that role, as I was saying to Terry during the break, because I think it‘s absolute insanity that you‘ve got “The New York Times” you‘ve got United Nations bureaucrats attacking America as stingy, when the bottom line is that the United States of America gives $34, $35 billion a year in private donations to help people overseas in charities.
And then you look and see what we do to United Nations—what we do with the United Nations. We give them about 40 percent of the money they need for the aid, for world aid in situations like this. And when I was in Congress on the Armed Services Committee, time and time again, you would have every foreign country coming to us asking us to help out. And we would do it. We would do it with humanitarian assistance and we would also do it in peacekeeping ways, spending billions and billions of dollars that came.
And this is what the U.N. bureaucrats don‘t get. This is what “The New York Times” doesn‘t understand. It doesn‘t come from some magical pot in Washington, D.C. It comes from your pocket. The United States taxpayer pays for this stuff. And “The New York Times” and U.N. bureaucrats and left-wing elitists seem to think that there‘s some golden pot in Washington, D.C., that we can just draw upon and it doesn‘t hurt anybody.
Well, guess what? It does hurt people if we continue to give more and more and more and we are still called cheapskates. We have got no problem giving this money to foreign countries when they need it, but I will tell you what we do have problems with, you and me. It‘s when we give more than everybody else, when we give 40 percent of what the entire world gives, and we are still called cheapskates. There‘s something wrong with that.
And I will tell you, there‘s also something wrong with the way that pop stars have been getting on the front pages of newspapers and magazines and these gossip rags over the past year.
And I talked about that with Carson Daly earlier.
By the way, New Year‘s Eve is going to be kicking off on NBC with a Rockefeller Center special that is actually going to be hosted by Carson Daly. And he joined me earlier in SCARBOROUGH COUNTRY.
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SCARBOROUGH: Carson, welcome to SCARBOROUGH COUNTRY.
And congratulations on this gig you got tomorrow night. It sounds like it‘s going to be huge. Tell our viewers about it.
CARSON DALY, “LAST CALL WITH CARSON DALY”: Well, thanks a lot, Joe.
It‘s pleasure to be here, No. 1. And provided I don‘t screw up my big NBC opportunity on in prime time, hopefully, it will be the beginning of a new New Year‘s Eve tradition at NBC.
The long and short of it is that I have a late-night show that is on when, well, America is sleeping, quite frankly. So, it‘s a good opportunity for me. And we are going to be on from 10:00 to 11:00. We are not actually covering the ball dropping. And we have Avril Lavigne, Maroon 5 and Duran Duran, Brian Williams, Conan O‘Brien, a bunch of people swinging by. It should be a very festive and fun hour.
SCARBOROUGH: I want to ask you a question.
DALY: Yes.
SCARBOROUGH: This week, we have been bringing on experts in the media related to sports, asking them, what are the big stories of 2004? Obviously, from your time at MTV and now your time with your late-night show, you have got your fingers on the pulse of pop culture.
What are the big stories in 2004 for pop culture? What were the big three?
DALY: Well, there‘s a couple big ones that you would go back and start off the year in 2004. And that was in January at the Super Bowl. That was an MTV-sanctioned event as well, and that was the whole Janet Jackson nipple-gate, as it‘s been referred to. And I read that in “The Wall Street Journal,” so I can say it on your show and feel confident.
SCARBOROUGH: Exactly. Exactly.
DALY: But I think it was symbolic in a lot of ways. To me, it triggered off 2004 and one of the more I think dangerous elements of pop culture in general. And that was Americans becoming enamored with celebrity, with the notion of celebrity, with voyeurism, with the issues of “stalkarazzi,” with like “Us Weekly,” boldfaced items.
Everything in 2004, celebrity scandal ended up doing much more for the careers of these celebrities. Where it used to be something that was taboo and you could worry about ruining your career, now a sex tape comes out or you break up with your girlfriend or any of the other—or you have a wardrobe malfunction, you‘re selling more records. You‘re selling more magazines. And I think that‘s a little dangerous. And I think 2004 really sort of summarized a lot of that.
It‘s a little frightening for younger people, too, who are now more interested in becoming famous than becoming good at what they do in whatever career they might choose, which I think is a little bit of a sad statement.
SCARBOROUGH: It‘s a concern.
Back in the 1980s, “The New Republic” had a cover story called “The Death of Shame.” Actually, I think you fast-forward to 2004 and you take Paris Hilton.
DALY: Yes.
SCARBOROUGH: I don‘t want to just pick on Paris Hilton. You could pick on a lot of people, but we actually found that she used a porn tape for the launching of a reality TV show and launching of a career.
DALY: Right.
SCARBOROUGH: Where she is getting all these endorsements and making millions and millions of dollars that she never would have made if she hadn‘t had this porn tape released conveniently to the press.
DALY: Right.
And it‘s just a little—I think it‘s the shortcuts that young pop culture are starting to utilize as a vehicle to get more towards their goal, which might be having a reality show, releasing a record, getting on the cover of magazines, selling more and therefore obviously taking in more money. I just think it‘s a little bit dangerous, but it seems to be working, and maybe we are all guilty of that.
The whole guilty pleasure thing now is just getting a little out of control. Britney Spears got married twice in 2004. I don‘t really care. I mean, I really just don‘t. That‘s not necessarily—good for her.
SCARBOROUGH: Yes.
DALY: And I hope she has a long and happy life, but I don‘t care.
If I want to take my niece to see her concert tonight, I care about that evening with my niece, who wants to see Britney Spears. I don‘t need to read every single day about who is Saint Barts on the beach with who.
SCARBOROUGH: Exactly.
Well, let‘s end on a positive note here. Obviously, I grew up listening, even though it was a little before my time, a lot of great bands from the ‘60s and ‘70s, even early ‘80s. Give me a band that we should be looking at or a talented young star that we should be keeping our eyes on in 2005. Who is not taking the shortcuts? Who is doing it the right way?
DALY: Well, you know, I am glad you asked me that, Joe. And I wasn‘t prepared for you to ask me that. But I can say, at the latter part of 2004, the band Maroon 5, that came from an independent label, Octone, and did it right. They toured. They did all the right things. There was no shortcuts. They‘re up for two Grammys. They have had a great year.
SCARBOROUGH: Hey, Carson, thanks for being with us tonight. And good luck tomorrow night. I know we are going to be watching. I know my two boys are going to be watching.
DALY: Awesome.
SCARBOROUGH: They have always been big fans of yours.
DALY: Oh, cool.
SCARBOROUGH: And I know you are going to hit it out of the park. I know you are going to hit it out of the park, just like Johnny Damon in game seven against the Yankees.
DALY: Easy with that, Joe, please. You‘ve got to get the final word, don‘t you?
(LAUGHTER)
SCARBOROUGH: All right. I sure do.
Well, thanks, Carson. We appreciate it.
DALY: Thank you very much.
SCARBOROUGH: Good luck.
DALY: Happy new year. Thanks a lot, Joe.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
SCARBOROUGH: A great guy. And I‘ll tell you what. It‘s going to be great tomorrow night. You ought to tune in and watch it.
Now, still ahead, my summary of the biggest stories of 2004, from the passing of Ronald Reagan, to—oh, I hate to even say his name—Michael Moore, and, of course, the shocking reelection of George W. Bush.
That‘s when SCARBOROUGH COUNTRY returns.
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SCARBOROUGH: As all SCARBOROUGH COUNTRY fans know, you can get the latest from SCARBOROUGH COUNTRY at Joe.MSNBC.com. And you get my blog at JoeBlog.MSNBC.com.
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SCARBOROUGH: As 2004 draws to a close, I‘m reminded of the line that is often used at the funerals of former hippies about what a long, strange strip it‘s been.
You know, that Grateful Dead line applies to 2004 because the cultural divide between ‘60s survivors and Reagan followers has never been greater than this year. It‘s been Rush Limbaugh vs. Al Franken, Mel Gibson vs. Michael Moore, and Internet bloggers vs. Dan Rather.
Oh, yes, and George W. Bush squared off against John Kerry. And, as I told you for months before that election, the president shocked his liberal critics, who thought him too dumb to get reelected.
But the year started with Janet Jackson‘s wardrobe malfunction and CBS‘ pelvic bump-and-grind fest at the Super Bowl. Now, liberal TV critics love to pass all that off as a split-second of flesh. But it was the crotch-o-rama fiesta that preceded Jackson‘s stunt that angered parents in Middle America the most. But most liberal critics didn‘t get it then. They don‘t get it now. And they never will get it.
You know, Mel Gibson‘s “Passion” also enraged liberals and blue state provocateurs like “The New York Times”‘ Frank Rich, whose savage attack of Mel Gibson weeks before the movie even premiered probably did more to help sell tickets than anything else.
Of course, conservatives returned the favor a few months later by blasting Michael Moore‘s “Fahrenheit 9/11.” Now, the movie was blatantly biased and it was intellectually dishonest from start to finish. But, like Frank Rich, conservatives like me helped Michael Moore by protesting too much.
The one positive outcome of that movie, though, was revealing as lying stooges all those liberal elitists who knew the movie was riddled with lies, but supported it anyway.
Now, “The Washington Post”‘s Richard Cohen was a notable exception, because Mr. Cohen stayed above the fray by bashing Michael Moore, while still opposing President Bush‘s war, a rarity among 2004 among left-wing intellectuals.
Now, we said goodbye this year, of course, to Ronald Reagan, the man who stared down communism and critics in both parties, to disregard detente and call the Soviet Union by its real name, the evil empire. And because of that, tens of millions of Europeans, including those of Ukraine, owe their newfound freedom to the Gipper.
God bless you, Ronald Reagan and your wonderful wife, Nancy, also. She‘s won the hearts of all Americans with her grace and strength under the toughest of circumstances.
The 2004 election, of course, is going to be dissected by Democrats for many years to come. They faced what they considered to be a weak opponent during an unpopular war, while gas prices were at an all-time high and with an economy that most pundits predicted would be the president‘s downfall. Add to that fact that Democrats turned out their base in record numbers and raised more money than ever before and maybe you can understand why Democratic strategists are more than a little concerned that they find themselves in the political wilderness.
But they should take heart in the story of Jesus‘ rise and fall and rise again in American pop cultural. You know, just a generation ago, God was declared dead and Jesus was less popular than John, Paul, George and Ringo. At least that‘s what they told us. But, 40 years later, Jesus is back in a big way. Politicos and pundits debate his impact on the election that took place halfway across the world from where he was born 2,000 years ago. And America‘s top news magazines and TV shows continue to discuss his birth, his death and his resurrection.
Who would have guessed that a year that started with a heated debate over an aging pop star‘s nipple would end with a national discussion on the political and cultural impact of a man that a billion Christians call their personal lord and savior?
Well, we here at SCARBOROUGH COUNTRY would, because we understand that faith and family and patriotism are not quaint concepts. They are the very things that parents are clinging to in a world that keeps moving toward an unknown destination at a breakneck speed.
You know, we don‘t know where this journey is going to take us, but we do know what we believe. And, in 2004, that‘s not something you could have said of the Democrats‘ presidential nominee. But I close tonight by thanking John Kerry for his service to America and his decision to run for president.
Unless you have stepped into the public arena, you have no idea just how brutal that process can be. To all of you out there that dared to do it, God bless you for your public service. And for those who haven‘t, consider Atticus Finch‘s suggestion that we walk a mile in another man‘s shoes before offering our criticism.
May God bless you and your family in the new year. May God bless our president. May God bless our troops fighting overseas. And may all of us always dare to fight for what we believe in, but never, ever give in to hate.
Good night from SCARBOROUGH COUNTRY. We‘ll see you on Monday night.
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
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